Topic: Sabah

[Drailph]

Philippine govt still owes favor from malaysia for helping(with personal agenda) in milf peace process thats why Pnoy doesnt want to help the Kirams.

The Sultanate need all our help since they are Filipinos like all of us. Yet attention is veered away in the philppine media. While they are being labeled as intuders and terorrists in their own land in malaysian media.

Malaysian govt simply had conflict of interest on Sabah when it offered itself as facilitator in the grp-milf peace talks because they wanted sabah. And was also a supporter of the milf.

The sulu sultanate are suluks/tausugs thats why they are not in good terms with the milf which are mostly maranaos.
So they are alone in their plight. And also left out in the grp-milf talks.

If the sultanate successfully reclaims sabah , but then the philippine goverment did not help, would it do what singapore did when it became independent of malaysia?


The first thing my british boss told me years ago: don't trust your malaysian colleagues.
I wonder why.

[BlueAlphaZero]

The Sultanate need all our help since they are Filipinos like all of us. Yet attention is veered away in the philppine media. While they are being labeled as intuders and terorrists in their own land in malaysian media.

Filipinos they may be but personally I don't think I can support an armed extraterritorial incursion since that's illegal. After all, Sabah is a Malaysian state unless proven otherwise through legal means.

The first thing my british boss told me years ago: don't trust your malaysian colleagues.
I wonder why.

I once worked for an American employer who told me he didn't trust Jews and "colored people"; a French employer who disliked Arabs; and a Filipino employer who felt nothing but scorn for non-Chinese. Might it be possible that your boss and mine were all simply racists?

By the way, perhaps you should have posted this in the Politics board, Écuyer Drailph. I don't think this is exactly material for the Area 51 board. Consult a moderator if you wish to have it transferred.

[Drailph]

Thanks.
Please transfer post if necessary.

I just thought it belong in this forum simply because they are plain theories.

Ah, my boss might have had a personal experience with some of them that led to his opinion and we were on a multinational company. I was the only filipino. He might just be concerned.

But its the same situation in all companies , even our own fellow filipinos have groups in the workplace whom you dont rather be associated with .

[CHILO20]

i suggest to fuck the hell with the malaysians and fuck the hell with the milfs. .
deal with them both, we dont need help from the malaysians,
we got usa

[xeoxander01]

i suggest to fuck the hell with the malaysians and fuck the hell with the milfs. .
deal with them both, we dont need help from the malaysians,
we got usa

or do we?

[ogamer104]

or do we?

Tama.

[BlueAlphaZero]

i suggest to fuck the hell with the malaysians and fuck the hell with the milfs. .
deal with them both, we dont need help from the malaysians,
we got usa

Seigneur, pardon me for being so bold but please watch your language. There is no need to use invective in order to state your point emphatically.

[gkhan]

Ang pagaari ng Malaysia ay nahahati lang sa mga Datu na sya ang mayari ng lupa. Halimbawa, isang Datu ang mayari ng lupa na kun saan andun ang Kuala Lumpur. Pag ayaw papasukin ng Datu ang Prime Minister sa kanyang lupain, that is his prerogative.  Ganun din ang Sabah, ang pagaari nito ay nasa sa Sultanate ng Sulu. In fact, in modern times, Malaysia pa rin ang may pinakamaraming Royalty.  Hindi kailangan tingnan ang mga political motives. Tingnan lang kun ano ang tama.  Historically and legally, the Sultanate owns Sabah. They have proprietary ownership of the land. And desisyon ng pamahalaan ay dapat kun ano lang ang tama.  Hindi dapat bigyan ng political color or conspiracy theories ito. Bilang pinuno ng High School Student Council, nararapat lamang na anumang desisyon ni Senyor Simyon ay kun ano ang tama at legal. Dahil Filipino ang mga Kiram, it is incumbent on Senyor Simyon to defend the interests of a Filipino.

[BlueAlphaZero]

Ang pagaari ng Malaysia ay nahahati lang sa mga Datu na sya ang mayari ng lupa. Halimbawa, isang Datu ang mayari ng lupa na kun saan andun ang Kuala Lumpur. Pag ayaw papasukin ng Datu ang Prime Minister sa kanyang lupain, that is his prerogative.  Ganun din ang Sabah, ang pagaari nito ay nasa sa Sultanate ng Sulu. In fact, in modern times, Malaysia pa rin ang may pinakamaraming Royalty.  Hindi kailangan tingnan ang mga political motives. Tingnan lang kun ano ang tama.  Historically and legally, the Sultanate owns Sabah. They have proprietary ownership of the land. And desisyon ng pamahalaan ay dapat kun ano lang ang tama.  Hindi dapat bigyan ng political color or conspiracy theories ito. Bilang pinuno ng High School Student Council, nararapat lamang na anumang desisyon ni Senyor Simyon ay kun ano ang tama at legal. Dahil Filipino ang mga Kiram, it is incumbent on Senyor Simyon to defend the interests of a Filipino.

Even if what that Filipino did is illegal?

[Idiot]

Even if what that Filipino did is illegal?

illegal sya in the sense yun lang ang nakita natin pero the reality itself di natin nakikita

parang akin ang sabah sasabihin sayo di ka pwedeng pumasok dapat kumuha ka muna ng ganito at ganun

parang sariling bahay muna at lupa ayaw kang papasukin ng guard at ikukulong kapa kapag nagpumilit ka

matagal ng ang issue na ito and the Kiram's were tired in waiting

and AFAIK 40k pinoys every year ang nadedeport galing sa sabah

[gkhan]

Nun panahon ni Ms.Corazon, ayaw nya pabalikin si Mr. Marcos sa Pilipinas.  Pag bumalik ito, she considers the act as illegal.  Will coming back to one's own country considered an "illegal" act?  Ang Sabah ay pagaari ng Sultanate. "Illegal" ba ang pagpunta sa sarili mong lupa?  Sabah is a big historical plunder and distortion. Alam naman ng UK na nag lease lamang ang North Borneo Trading Co. nguni't isinama nila ito sa Malaysia nun itinatag ang federation ng Malaysia nuong early 60s. Ginamit ng Britain ang lakas nila upang angkinin ang lupang di naman nila pagaari. Nagsawa na lamang ang mga Kiram sa pag aantay kaya nila ginawa iyon.  Maski sino naman na may ari ng lupa, gagawin iyon.

[BlueAlphaZero]

matagal ng ang issue na ito and the Kiram's were tired in waiting

Nagsawa na lamang ang mga Kiram sa pag aantay kaya nila ginawa iyon.  Maski sino naman na may ari ng lupa, gagawin iyon.

Unfortunately, gentlemen, the Kirams' impatience cost more than they bargained for when they decided to undertake this ill-considered venture.

[Idiot]

Unfortunately, gentlemen, the Kirams' impatience cost more than they bargained for when they decided to undertake this ill-considered venture.

because they are warriors class  they don't care kung mamatay sila or makulong pride nilang makapatay at mamatay di sila kamukha ng mga tagalog or ilokano or anoman tribo sa luzon na pinaiiral ang sibilidad kaya nga nasakop kaagad ang lusung at di nasakop ng kastila at americano ang mindanao

every year as i said before almost 40k ang nadedeport sa sabah even may permanent residency na sila

common 50-40 years of waiting di nga sila sinusuportahan ng gobyerno tapos nakikita mo pa ang mga kababayan mo nadedeport parang teka sa atin yun bakit pinpaalis sila

[futek]

kayo kaya di papasukin sa sarili mong bahay, tapos ngsumbong ka sa pulis di ka pinag aksayahan ng panahon, di ka ba magwawala 

[ogamer104]

kayo kaya di papasukin sa sarili mong bahay, tapos ngsumbong ka sa pulis di ka pinag aksayahan ng panahon, di ka ba magwawala 

Malaysia pays the Sultanate rent.

So,pumunta ka dun sa paupahan mo at may dala kang baril.You planned to evict them but instead you got some of your tenants killed.Nagsumbong ka sa UN pero hindi ka pinansin.Tinawag ka pang terrorista.

Hanep,overly simplified na.

[BlueAlphaZero]

because they are warriors class  they don't care kung mamatay sila or makulong pride nilang makapatay at mamatay di sila kamukha ng mga tagalog or ilokano or anoman tribo sa luzon na pinaiiral ang sibilidad kaya nga nasakop kaagad ang lusung at di nasakop ng kastila at americano ang mindanao

Would you care to rephrase this statement, m'sieur? The way it comes across is that you just said that the Kirams' followers are uncivilized.

[Ilonggo-by-blood]

I think may right ang mga Kiram sa Sabah it was owned by the Sultan of Borneo given to the Sultan os Sulu. But It was NOT properly documented.

Naala niyo na nong panahon mura lang ang Lupa but now it is very important as an assest. So napabayaan noong nag rent ang mga Briton.

So sinu may sala sinu ang tunay na Baliw? ainung dakila?

[Idiot]

So,pumunta ka dun sa paupahan mo at may dala kang baril.You planned to evict them but instead you got some of your tenants killed.Nagsumbong ka sa UN pero hindi ka pinansin.Tinawag ka pang terrorista.

so paano mo nalaman na sina kiram ang unang bumaril

Would you care to rephrase this statement, m'sieur? The way it comes across is that you just said that the Kirams' followers are uncivilized.

uncivilized in what way

ancient chinese viewed the westerners and other countries uncivilized they follow the ancient Confucius teaching

ancient westerners viewed other countries as uncivilized

ancient rome viewed there neighbors as barbarians

spain called the natives Indio

as a educated and moral person of course you viewed kirams as uncivilized or barbaric

but for the Kirams view they do what is right for them what they did is right for pride, justice, dignity of a warrior class tribe for them the tradition and social norms of their tribe is to fight and die


 

[kluverbucy]

Habang nagpapatrolya yung mga malaysian police sa mga bahay bahay inambush sila according sa lahat ng news, malamang mga tao ni kiram ang unang nagpa putok alangan naman nakatago ang mga tao ni kiram tapos sila ang pinaputukan nakatago nga eh ang daming civilian dun. Yung ibang civilian nadin dun ang nagsabi sa mga interview.

Clamsy moves ang tawag sa ginawa ng mga kiram, binulabog nila ang mga tao dun na tahimik na namumuhay tsinempo talaga nila ito sa election sigurado may kunchabahan at sulsol dyan. Ngayon ang daming buhay ang nalagas at nawalan ng tirahan dahil sa ginawa nila.

Siguro kung pumunta sila dun at hindi heavily armed baka sakali maging ok pa ang lahat eh, So nasan ang mga leader leaderan nila ngayon? Parang wala akong nabalitaan na namatay sa ingkwentro na Kiram, halos supporters daw??? na member karamihan ng MNLF. tsk tsk tsk

[ogamer104]

idiot.


i said. " you got some of your tenants killed."

Ibig ko bang sabihin nun ay sila ang unang bumaril?

[BlueAlphaZero]

as a educated and moral person of course you viewed kirams as uncivilized or barbaric

but for the Kirams view they do what is right for them what they did is right for pride, justice, dignity of a warrior class tribe for them the tradition and social norms of their tribe is to fight and die

I agree with you wholeheartedly, M'sieur Idiot. The Kirams did indeed do what was right - for them. Not what was right for their people but what was right for them. For all the talk of the Kirams coming from a tribe of warriors, the Sultan comes across (to me, anyway) as someone who sowed serpent's teeth but then found that he had no stomach for the harvest.

[Ilonggo-by-blood]

My view is this... Kasi sa mga Kiram sa kanila ang lupaing ito eh. Tapus kukunin ng eka nga Land Reform. So binigay sa Ninuno nila tapus kukunin ng Malaysia with extreme force medyo mali naman yun.

Feeling ko lang ha eventually the people responsible for killing the Royal  Army of Sulu will be trialed sa international criminal court for international crime against humanity.

[Idiot]

i said. " you got some of your tenants killed."

Ibig ko bang sabihin nun ay sila ang unang bumaril?

kaya nga tinatanong kung sino ang unang bumaril

I agree with you wholeheartedly, M'sieur Idiot. The Kirams did indeed do what was right - for them. Not what was right for their people but what was right for them. For all the talk of the Kirams coming from a tribe of warriors, the Sultan comes across (to me, anyway) as someone who sowed serpent's teeth but then found that he had no stomach for the harvest.

that's true for them only that's their right

if read Morgas Succesos de las Islas Pilipinas

in Lusung Rajah matanda and Rajah Mura humbly accepted the spaniards. they even built encomiendas and help to defend the Manila from Lima-hong they only rebel because the spaniards did not defend the natives as promised from Moro pirates and from holandes and xapon pirates

and in Mindanao the mohammedans in Jolo and the two tribes fighting the buhahayen and  the tampacan. the spaniards had the difficulty pacifying that region. they constantly at war. After the spaniards left the fort they built. The moros unite and plan to plunder the costal town of ternate and cebu land of pintados. They failed at first but they try again with success looting villages and taking slaves.

I stop reading at the holandes  incursion wherein Morga was in-charged

even in history they are warrior before the spaniards came. they don't argue with civility like the predecessors of lusung

To understand the kirams action you need to understand our history. They don't teach that in school   

     

[ogamer104]

kaya nga tinatanong kung sino ang unang bumaril

That's different from your first query which is.

"so paano mo nalaman na sina kiram ang unang bumaril"

This is reference to my post.right?

[BlueAlphaZero]

that's true for them only that's their right
if read Morgas Succesos de las Islas Pilipinas

in Lusung Rajah matanda and Rajah Mura humbly accepted the spaniards. they even built encomiendas and help to defend the Manila from Lima-hong they only rebel because the spaniards did not defend the natives as promised from Moro pirates and from holandes and xapon pirates

and in Mindanao the mohammedans in Jolo and the two tribes fighting the buhahayen and  the tampacan. the spaniards had the difficulty pacifying that region. they constantly at war. After the spaniards left the fort they built. The moros unite and plan to plunder the costal town of ternate and cebu land of pintados. They failed at first but they try again with success looting villages and taking slaves.

I stop reading at the holandes  incursion wherein Morga was in-charged

even in history they are warrior before the spaniards came. they don't argue with civility like the predecessors of lusung

To understand the kirams action you need to understand our history. They don't teach that in school   

I freely grant that I might not be as learned as you, M'sieur Idiot, but I understand our history enough to know all too well that (to paraphrase a line from a movie) there will always be people like the Kirams.