Topic: Filipino Nurse and The New Slave Trade

[Gino]

Jokjok, allow me to sympathize with your girlfriend-nurse and call her a "whore" and a "slave."

(Of course, I didn't mean that and I apologize to your lovely girlfriend, but I have to say it to make you realize the errors of your argument.)

*applauds*

[jokjok maton]

How is it sympathetic? Anyone who looks at your image wouldn't give a second guess at how it mocks the Filipino nurse.

And you deliberately took my statement out of context. I said "YOU are portraying them as pathetic indigenous creatures who are in need of protection." No offense to the Aetas, but the sensationalists such as yourself have portrayed them as such so many times and for so long that it is hard to remove the connotation that such an image evokes. Are they pathetic? No. Are they in need of protection? That is debatable. But obviously, the connotation your picture evokes is just that. Saying that Filipino nurses are just pathetic slaves that need protection and SHOWING that by using a picture of an Aeta in a nurse uniform is downright cruel. Who's being the racist now?

Fallacy: Kayo nga member ng site dito...
Fact: Eh ikaw? Nde ka ba member ng site na to? You're being more and more of a hypocrite by the second, boy.

Who are you to say: "Kawawa ang mga OFWs sa makitid na utak na ganyan"? Nurses abroad are better off abroad, materially, emotionally and sociologically. The same can be said of a majority of skilled workers working in foreign lands. Most have migrated abroad because they are simply sick and tired of the living conditions here in our country. So how are they "kawawa"?

I'll give you a logically correct example of kawawa: Nurses - and an overwhelming majority of workers - here who are working long ungodly hours, to be paid only the minimum wage. So, who's the greater slave master now?

I'm not old, and even if I were, atleast I'm not young and stupid.

Hello Gino,
You are escaping.
You are using these words,your words againts me.
You just said they are creatures.

Ako ba pinagloloko mo?
Yes, you are not stupid.You even know how to play with words-a pathological liar,I guess.You just said it.And then you deny it?Kitang kita na nga eh.

You racist.

That is not how I portrayed the "creature" (according to you) which you think is mockery.That is just according to your "denotation".
Perhaps you attend an art appreciation class under my tutelage so you will know more about "deconstruction".

[jokjok maton]

Jokjok, allow me to sympathize with your girlfriend-nurse and call her a "whore" and a "slave."

(Of course, I didn't mean that and I apologize to your lovely girlfriend, but I have to say it to make you realize the errors of your argument.)

Be my guest.It's only your errors in your understanding where the problem is rooted.
I got you.Yes,you will say that.
My GF is too pretty to be used in the image.She's a mestiza and I know,she can never represent the porr Filipino image.Mukha kasi siyang sosyal.

Whatever you say Bro.

[2fear!]

ok tong usapang ito... wala lang sakitan!  peace tayo dito... 

[Stukov]

suntukan na lang kayu para matapos na!!!

[Gino]

How is it sympathetic? Anyone who looks at your image wouldn't give a second guess at how it mocks the Filipino nurse.

And you deliberately took my statement out of context. I said "YOU are portraying them as pathetic indigenous creatures who are in need of protection." No offense to the Aetas, but the sensationalists such as yourself have portrayed them as such so many times and for so long that it is hard to remove the connotation that such an image evokes. Are they pathetic? No. Are they in need of protection? That is debatable. But obviously, the connotation your picture evokes is just that. Saying that Filipino nurses are just pathetic slaves that need protection and SHOWING that by using a picture of an Aeta in a nurse uniform is downright cruel. Who's being the racist now?

Fallacy: Kayo nga member ng site dito...
Fact: Eh ikaw? Nde ka ba member ng site na to? You're being more and more of a hypocrite by the second, boy.

Who are you to say: "Kawawa ang mga OFWs sa makitid na utak na ganyan"? Nurses abroad are better off abroad, materially, emotionally and sociologically. The same can be said of a majority of skilled workers working in foreign lands. Most have migrated abroad because they are simply sick and tired of the living conditions here in our country. So how are they "kawawa"?

I'll give you a logically correct example of kawawa: Nurses - and an overwhelming majority of workers - here who are working long ungodly hours, to be paid only the minimum wage. So, who's the greater slave master now?

I'm not old, and even if I were, atleast I'm not young and stupid.

Hello Gino,
You are escaping.
You are using these words,your words againts me.
You just said they are creatures.

Ako ba pinagloloko mo?
Yes, you are not stupid.You even know how to play with words-a pathological liar,I guess.You just said it.And then you deny it?Kitang kita na nga eh.

You racist.

That is not how I portrayed the "creature" (according to you) which you think is mockery.That is just according to your "denotation".
Perhaps you attend an art appreciation class under my tutelage so you will know more about "deconstruction".

Oooh art appreciation class under your tutelage? You teach art? Oh my, you committed one of the many mistakes that beginners make with regards to composition. You claim that your subject - a slave nurse in this instance (which you also conveniently portrayed as an Aeta, you racist, you) is not a whore, yet you underline it with the words HollyWhore. By relation, any layman can make the conclusion that an Aeta in a nurse outfit = HollyWhore? You naughty racist, you.

I do not claim to be a master of the arts, but anyone who appreciates art can see the bluntness of your mistake.

How am I escaping? I give arguments, while you give none in return.

[Gino]

Jokjok, allow me to sympathize with your girlfriend-nurse and call her a "whore" and a "slave."

(Of course, I didn't mean that and I apologize to your lovely girlfriend, but I have to say it to make you realize the errors of your argument.)

Be my guest.It's only your errors in your understanding where the problem is rooted.
I got you.Yes,you will say that.
My GF is too pretty to be used in the image.She's a mestiza and I know,she can never represent the porr Filipino image.Mukha kasi siyang sosyal.

Whatever you say Bro.

Now you're saying that your GF, who happens to be a mestiza, is better than the Aetas? Tsk tsk you naughty racist,you.

[jokjok maton]

Jokjok, allow me to sympathize with your girlfriend-nurse and call her a "whore" and a "slave."

(Of course, I didn't mean that and I apologize to your lovely girlfriend, but I have to say it to make you realize the errors of your argument.)

Be my guest.It's only your errors in your understanding where the problem is rooted.
I got you.Yes,you will say that.
My GF is too pretty to be used in the image.She's a mestiza and I know,she can never represent the porr Filipino image.Mukha kasi siyang sosyal.

Whatever you say Bro.

Now you're saying that your GF, who happens to be a mestiza, is better than the Aetas? Tsk tsk you naughty racist,you.

Ah you don't get it.Haha.
She's mestiza.And as a graphic designer and artist,there is what they call semiotics,universal symbolisms of images and text that depicts universal understanding.
From the common subjects in Philippine Art History,a Filipino is often depicted as very-native looking person.And basically,artist used the image of a malay decent or aeta decent to represent a Filipino.Alam mo ba yun?

Hindi pwedi ang mestiza bro.Hehe.

You have to get a master of arts nga to know more about this,not just merely criticizing a work you yourself cannot do and understand.

[bodieph]

sigh... this is just a case of semantics

I cant believe someone is even arguing fallacies here. The flaw here is not what someone is saying, but rather how the other is understanding.

The word slave as understood by most people is what gino and masterchief seem to point out while the thread starter is obviously referring to it in another context. The former is interpreting literally (including the words being used), the latter figuratively. This is more of art than literary work.

So in this, no one will obviously win since both have valid points.

I understand both sides of the argument. The first reply was indeed correct. It will offend some who will obviously interpret it differently and we are seeing that right now.

To the critics keep this in mind, by criticizing a work of art, you are actually helping to promote it. So if your goal is for it to be dismissed as merely art and not something more, it might be prudent to keep the criticizing to a minimum. You said your argument, leave it at that.

[jokjok maton]

How is it sympathetic? Anyone who looks at your image wouldn't give a second guess at how it mocks the Filipino nurse.

And you deliberately took my statement out of context. I said "YOU are portraying them as pathetic indigenous creatures who are in need of protection." No offense to the Aetas, but the sensationalists such as yourself have portrayed them as such so many times and for so long that it is hard to remove the connotation that such an image evokes. Are they pathetic? No. Are they in need of protection? That is debatable. But obviously, the connotation your picture evokes is just that. Saying that Filipino nurses are just pathetic slaves that need protection and SHOWING that by using a picture of an Aeta in a nurse uniform is downright cruel. Who's being the racist now?

Fallacy: Kayo nga member ng site dito...
Fact: Eh ikaw? Nde ka ba member ng site na to? You're being more and more of a hypocrite by the second, boy.

Who are you to say: "Kawawa ang mga OFWs sa makitid na utak na ganyan"? Nurses abroad are better off abroad, materially, emotionally and sociologically. The same can be said of a majority of skilled workers working in foreign lands. Most have migrated abroad because they are simply sick and tired of the living conditions here in our country. So how are they "kawawa"?

I'll give you a logically correct example of kawawa: Nurses - and an overwhelming majority of workers - here who are working long ungodly hours, to be paid only the minimum wage. So, who's the greater slave master now?

I'm not old, and even if I were, atleast I'm not young and stupid.

Hello Gino,
You are escaping.
You are using these words,your words againts me.
You just said they are creatures.

Ako ba pinagloloko mo?
Yes, you are not stupid.You even know how to play with words-a pathological liar,I guess.You just said it.And then you deny it?Kitang kita na nga eh.

You racist.

That is not how I portrayed the "creature" (according to you) which you think is mockery.That is just according to your "denotation".
Perhaps you attend an art appreciation class under my tutelage so you will know more about "deconstruction".

Oooh art appreciation class under your tutelage? You teach art? Oh my, you committed one of the many mistakes that beginners make with regards to composition. You claim that your subject - a slave nurse in this instance (which you also conveniently portrayed as an Aeta, you racist, you) is not a whore, yet you underline it with the words HollyWhore. By relation, any layman can make the conclusion that an Aeta in a nurse outfit = HollyWhore? You naughty racist, you.

I do not claim to be a master of the arts, but anyone who appreciates art can see the bluntness of your mistake.

How am I escaping? I give arguments, while you give none in return.

Dapat ka ngang mag aral my friend.
Hindi ibig sabihin na nasa ibaba siya,yung ung name niya.
Kagaya din yan sa advertising.
Hindi kelangan ng tinatapal ng babae ang napkin sa "twingtwing" niya para ipakita na "MODESS" and ibinebenta at para sa "twingtwing" ang gamit dun.

Nakuha mo ba?
hehe

[jokjok maton]

sigh... this is just a case of semantics

I cant believe someone is even arguing fallacies here. The flaw here is not what someone is saying, but rather how the other is understanding.

The word slave as understood by most people is what gino and masterchief seem to point out while the thread starter is obviously referring to it in another context. The former is interpreting literally (including the words being used), the latter figuratively. This is more of art than literary work.

So in this, no one will obviously win since both have valid points.

I understand both sides of the argument. The first reply was indeed correct. It will offend some who will obviously interpret it differently and we are seeing that right now.

To the critics keep this in mind, by criticizing a work of art, you are actually helping to promote it. So if your goal is for it to be dismissed as merely art and not something more, it might be prudent to keep the criticizing to a minimum. You said your argument, leave it at that.

Yes,I am insisting that the image is sympathetic to the hardships of Filipino nurses as a whole.And then,why do they keep on arguing that it states the opposite?
There are symbolisms that are to be considered here which are according to the preference of the artist.
Then,they are those who give malice to the image,even stating that,according to Gino,the Aeta image is just a mere pathetic poor creature?Isn't that a racist?

Hindi ako ang kalaban dito.

[sinnerman]

sigh... this is just a case of semantics

I cant believe someone is even arguing fallacies here. The flaw here is not what someone is saying, but rather how the other is understanding.

The word slave as understood by most people is what gino and masterchief seem to point out while the thread starter is obviously referring to it in another context. The former is interpreting literally (including the words being used), the latter figuratively. This is more of art than literary work.

So in this, no one will obviously win since both have valid points.

I understand both sides of the argument. The first reply was indeed correct. It will offend some who will obviously interpret it differently and we are seeing that right now.

To the critics keep this in mind, by criticizing a work of art, you are actually helping to promote it. So if your goal is for it to be dismissed as merely art and not something more, it might be prudent to keep the criticizing to a minimum. You said your argument, leave it at that.

I totally agree to this.

ok now anyone for an icecream? masyadong mainit.

[b0ler0]

I prepared a lengthy reply, but I decided not to post it.

In my mind, Jokjok, you're wrong, and in your mind, you are correct.  I doubt anything any of us will say will change that, and this will go on endlessly.

So, para matapos na to at makapunta naman ako sa talagang pakay ko dito - ang porn - igaganti ko na lang ang mga nurses who received your own brand of sympathy with my own piece of deconstructive art.  Eto...



Yan ang art!

[coated_pill]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

[Gino]

How is it sympathetic? Anyone who looks at your image wouldn't give a second guess at how it mocks the Filipino nurse.

And you deliberately took my statement out of context. I said "YOU are portraying them as pathetic indigenous creatures who are in need of protection." No offense to the Aetas, but the sensationalists such as yourself have portrayed them as such so many times and for so long that it is hard to remove the connotation that such an image evokes. Are they pathetic? No. Are they in need of protection? That is debatable. But obviously, the connotation your picture evokes is just that. Saying that Filipino nurses are just pathetic slaves that need protection and SHOWING that by using a picture of an Aeta in a nurse uniform is downright cruel. Who's being the racist now?

Fallacy: Kayo nga member ng site dito...
Fact: Eh ikaw? Nde ka ba member ng site na to? You're being more and more of a hypocrite by the second, boy.

Who are you to say: "Kawawa ang mga OFWs sa makitid na utak na ganyan"? Nurses abroad are better off abroad, materially, emotionally and sociologically. The same can be said of a majority of skilled workers working in foreign lands. Most have migrated abroad because they are simply sick and tired of the living conditions here in our country. So how are they "kawawa"?

I'll give you a logically correct example of kawawa: Nurses - and an overwhelming majority of workers - here who are working long ungodly hours, to be paid only the minimum wage. So, who's the greater slave master now?

I'm not old, and even if I were, atleast I'm not young and stupid.

Hello Gino,
You are escaping.
You are using these words,your words againts me.
You just said they are creatures.

Ako ba pinagloloko mo?
Yes, you are not stupid.You even know how to play with words-a pathological liar,I guess.You just said it.And then you deny it?Kitang kita na nga eh.

You racist.

That is not how I portrayed the "creature" (according to you) which you think is mockery.That is just according to your "denotation".
Perhaps you attend an art appreciation class under my tutelage so you will know more about "deconstruction".

Oooh art appreciation class under your tutelage? You teach art? Oh my, you committed one of the many mistakes that beginners make with regards to composition. You claim that your subject - a slave nurse in this instance (which you also conveniently portrayed as an Aeta, you racist, you) is not a whore, yet you underline it with the words HollyWhore. By relation, any layman can make the conclusion that an Aeta in a nurse outfit = HollyWhore? You naughty racist, you.

I do not claim to be a master of the arts, but anyone who appreciates art can see the bluntness of your mistake.

How am I escaping? I give arguments, while you give none in return.

Dapat ka ngang mag aral my friend.
Hindi ibig sabihin na nasa ibaba siya,yung ung name niya.
Kagaya din yan sa advertising.
Hindi kelangan ng tinatapal ng babae ang napkin sa "twingtwing" niya para ipakita na "MODESS" and ibinebenta at para sa "twingtwing" ang gamit dun.

Nakuha mo ba?
hehe

Since you're very particular with the use of terms, given your argument, your composition has a serious error in pragmatics. By using the image of a woman (a Filipina "slave" nurse) and coining the term HollyWhore underneath, you are conditioning you're viewers to presuppose that the nurse is indeed the whore in question. And mind you, that is the semantics that a vast MAJORITY understands and is accustomed to.

Like b0ler0, I have prepared a lengthy revocation of your arguments, but have decided to no longer pursue this conversation.

[jokjok maton]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

[jokjok maton]

How is it sympathetic? Anyone who looks at your image wouldn't give a second guess at how it mocks the Filipino nurse.

And you deliberately took my statement out of context. I said "YOU are portraying them as pathetic indigenous creatures who are in need of protection." No offense to the Aetas, but the sensationalists such as yourself have portrayed them as such so many times and for so long that it is hard to remove the connotation that such an image evokes. Are they pathetic? No. Are they in need of protection? That is debatable. But obviously, the connotation your picture evokes is just that. Saying that Filipino nurses are just pathetic slaves that need protection and SHOWING that by using a picture of an Aeta in a nurse uniform is downright cruel. Who's being the racist now?

Fallacy: Kayo nga member ng site dito...
Fact: Eh ikaw? Nde ka ba member ng site na to? You're being more and more of a hypocrite by the second, boy.

Who are you to say: "Kawawa ang mga OFWs sa makitid na utak na ganyan"? Nurses abroad are better off abroad, materially, emotionally and sociologically. The same can be said of a majority of skilled workers working in foreign lands. Most have migrated abroad because they are simply sick and tired of the living conditions here in our country. So how are they "kawawa"?

I'll give you a logically correct example of kawawa: Nurses - and an overwhelming majority of workers - here who are working long ungodly hours, to be paid only the minimum wage. So, who's the greater slave master now?

I'm not old, and even if I were, atleast I'm not young and stupid.

Hello Gino,
You are escaping.
You are using these words,your words againts me.
You just said they are creatures.

Ako ba pinagloloko mo?
Yes, you are not stupid.You even know how to play with words-a pathological liar,I guess.You just said it.And then you deny it?Kitang kita na nga eh.

You racist.

That is not how I portrayed the "creature" (according to you) which you think is mockery.That is just according to your "denotation".
Perhaps you attend an art appreciation class under my tutelage so you will know more about "deconstruction".

Oooh art appreciation class under your tutelage? You teach art? Oh my, you committed one of the many mistakes that beginners make with regards to composition. You claim that your subject - a slave nurse in this instance (which you also conveniently portrayed as an Aeta, you racist, you) is not a whore, yet you underline it with the words HollyWhore. By relation, any layman can make the conclusion that an Aeta in a nurse outfit = HollyWhore? You naughty racist, you.

I do not claim to be a master of the arts, but anyone who appreciates art can see the bluntness of your mistake.

How am I escaping? I give arguments, while you give none in return.

Dapat ka ngang mag aral my friend.
Hindi ibig sabihin na nasa ibaba siya,yung ung name niya.
Kagaya din yan sa advertising.
Hindi kelangan ng tinatapal ng babae ang napkin sa "twingtwing" niya para ipakita na "MODESS" and ibinebenta at para sa "twingtwing" ang gamit dun.

Nakuha mo ba?
hehe

Since you're very particular with the use of terms, given your argument, your composition has a serious error in pragmatics. By using the image of a woman (a Filipina "slave" nurse) and coining the term HollyWhore underneath, you are conditioning you're viewers to presuppose that the nurse is indeed the whore in question. And mind you, that is the semantics that a vast MAJORITY understands and is accustomed to.

Like b0ler0, I have prepared a lengthy revocation of your arguments, but have decided to no longer pursue this conversation.

Silence is defeat.
Haha.
Print the image and go get some art critic to tell you you are right.

[coated_pill]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

sounds to me like you're the slave here

[jokjok maton]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

sounds to me like you're the slave here

No problem.I have other assets.
So I am right.
According to you,slavery is based on the salary.
What about the 50 million underpaid Filipino workers who only get 5 thousand pesos a month? So they are slaves.

That's it.
You agreed with me.Thanks.

[MasterChief63]

if thats how you see this pic we see it in a different way, we are as you said entitled to our own opinions, still you have ignored the relevance of that iPhone qoute

The caption is a written in Capampangan.
Mommy (referring to the Nurse) ,
Padalhan mo naman ako ng pera
pambili ng bagong cellphone.
Kasi ung classmate ko may bagong I-PHONE.Sige na naman.

ok so what if its written in Capampangan i still am waiting for your explanation how this qoute is relevant to the point of "SLAVE/WHORE"

ok did anyone change the meaning of SLAVE and SLAVERY kasi i googled it and the 1st one i got was a Wiki definition:

Slavery (also called thralldom) is a social-economic system under which certain persons—known as slaves—are deprived of personal freedom and compelled to work.

Slaves are held against their will from the time of their capture, purchase, or birth, and are deprived of the right to leave, to refuse to work, or to receive compensation (such as wages) in return for their labor. As such, slavery is one form of unfree labor.

In its narrowest sense, the word slave refers to people who are treated as the property of another person, household, company, corporation or government. This is referred to as chattel slavery.

ok so FILIPINO NURSES CHOOSE TO TAKE THE NCLEX and IELTS and go through the proper methods to gain entry and work in the US for a fair/reasonable compensation for the their families and dependents... how again is this pic depicting SLAVERY? KEY WORD IS CHOOSE NOT FORCED

[Gino]

Mind you, I have far more important duties and obligations - work that actually produces something this country can use, and more importantly something which does not entail making a mockery of women going abroad. You can go talk and brag big about how you can help the "kawawang" nurses making "a-not-so-kawawang" living in foreign countries; I prefer making things happen.

[Gino]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

sounds to me like you're the slave here

*agreed*

[coated_pill]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

sounds to me like you're the slave here

That's it.
You agreed with me.Thanks.

Your ideas are completely opposing..so now you are indeed saying that low salary is synonymous with slavery. but moments ago you were referring to nurses as slaves, who earn around 250-450k pesos monthly. please make your point clear.

[jokjok maton]

Mind you, I have far more important duties and obligations - work that actually produces something this country can use, and more importantly something which does not entail making a mockery of women going abroad. You can go talk and brag big about how you can help the "kawawang" nurses making "a-not-so-kawawang" living in foreign countries; I prefer making things happen.

We have something in common pa la?
Why not agree with my statement that the image is sympathetic to Filipino Nurses?
It's you who make bad "denotation".
I make things happen too.I work for the betterment of the community,without any payback.I barely live a good life.So there is no reason to mock the nurses.
It's the Imperialist USA that I mock in here.You should not only consider your own perception.I am the creator of the image.I know what I mean.

Like what I said, "Silence is defeat".
That's the reason why I am asking you to ask an art critic so they can unfold the real meaning of the image.

I am not the enemy Gino.

[jokjok maton]

if you don't mind me asking jokjok, how much do you earn??

P8,000 a month and happy.

sounds to me like you're the slave here

That's it.
You agreed with me.Thanks.

Your ideas are completely opposing..so now you are indeed saying that low salary is synonymous with slavery. but moments ago you were referring to nurses as slaves, who earn around 250-450k pesos monthly. please make your point clear.

Hello Coated Pill.
What is the relevance of my salary to the image in the first place?
You were asking about my salary.So proud to say,I said them to you.

So you mean you are making a connection between my salary and the image as well as the whole discusion of this thread?

Katuwa ka naman kapatid.
Ikaw nga ang nalihis ng landas dito.